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Dioramas: Warships
Naval dioramas and related subjects
Hosted by Darren Baker
German Uboat TypeVIIB Conning Tower Gun Deck
PolishBrigade12
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Washington, United States
Joined: January 31, 2009
KitMaker: 268 posts
Armorama: 254 posts
Posted: Tuesday, April 17, 2018 - 09:45 PM UTC
This will be an SBS on how to deal with nylon 3D printed parts and kits. This kit was not cheap by any stretch of the imagination, nor was it easy to work with. The figures are not included in this SBS, but are only there for scale reference. This is a 1/16th scale project.

There's a lot of prep work that is required before you ever touch a paint brush. So, strap in as we go inverted and slam the throttle to the fire wall, Yehaaaaaaaaa!





Getting Started

Talk about a big undertaking, this is it! Ya know, I heard it said many, many moons ago, " When yur hind quarters and elbow in alligators ya begin to wonder why ya came to drain the swamp." HA!





When this beauty arrived I realized this was not gonna be much fun getting it prepped for paint. This gun deck is a 3D print, 1/16th scale rendition, accurate and impressive from Shapeways, specifically designed by Sasa Drobac. Link is here: https://www.shapeways.com/shops/distefano_3dprint

Sasa has a pretty impressive line up for boat builders of all kinds and many scales, so this is a good source. However, back to my initial impression upon delivery, yikes! If you've never dealt with nylon printed 3D parts you're in for a surprise. It's a lot of work and I never did the intel search to find out otherwise, it never crossed my mind. My boof!


Prepping The Pieces For Sanding

Not all is lost, won't get done lookin at it anyway, right? The nylon print actually is better for anything that is large or has delicate configurations. But, it does have a fuzzy, or grainy appearance and does not like to be sanded unless you give it a resin coat or hit it several times with a primer. After much research I went with the XTC-3D resin filler, worked like a charm. However, as with any resin, make sure your mixes are exact or they won't dry and that tacky coat is a real bugger to get rid of. Trust me on this, I ran the learning curve for you, lol.



Once the resin had cured and was sanded with 200 grid paper the deck began to look much better. All kidding aside, this is a lot of work, so be prepared to spend days getting it to where you can paint it. In the end, it's all worth the grumbling because nobody makes anything coming close to what I needed and Sasa with Shapways was the only answer. Sasa will special design to your needs, which is what he did here. It took a bit of communication back and forth to get it right, but like I said, well worth the extra time to get what you are looking for.


More to follow soon. Cheers, Ski.
sgtreef
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Oklahoma, United States
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Posted: Wednesday, April 18, 2018 - 12:33 AM UTC
Nice start, by the look of it got your work cut out for you.

Enjoy that deal, and remember no cursing, when kids or the old Lady is around.
joepanzer
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North Carolina, United States
Joined: January 21, 2004
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Posted: Wednesday, April 18, 2018 - 05:44 AM UTC
You had me at "Uboat"

Jeff-
Are you out of the way of the fires?
joepanzer
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Posted: Wednesday, April 18, 2018 - 05:46 AM UTC
Do you get a PE option for the flash hiders? They look a bit thick?
Kevlar06
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Posted: Wednesday, April 18, 2018 - 06:40 AM UTC
Ski,
Interesting project-- I just finished a 1/16 scale B17F waist gun position scratchbuilt in brass (with a highly modified figure from the Verlinden kit, which was the only thing worth saving from the box). So I feel your pain-- took me more than 2 years and about 300 hours of work. But before you get on with this one, where's that Normandy dio you were working on? Or did I miss it? Will you be coming to the Seattle IPMS show this weekend?
VR, Russ
PolishBrigade12
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Washington, United States
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Posted: Wednesday, April 18, 2018 - 07:10 AM UTC
Howdy Russ,

The huge 200mm dio is on hold till this one is done. Here's how the delay occurred; Track-link owner Paul Owens asked if I'd be willing to do another figure SBS, told him yes. That was 10-12 months earlier. So, when Alpine contacted me I couldn't say no. After the initial one was done Taesung offered another figure to do, and the rest is history. The figures are sponsored by Track-link, not this tower, so this SBS will be posted as I please.

Russ, I'm never in a hurry to get a project done unless I put a time constraint on myself, which is rare. If I did that all the time it wouldn't be any fun. So I know how ya feel Brotha, enjoy the process, watch many war flicks and have a cold one every now and again.

Thx for the encouragement Bro, Ski.
PolishBrigade12
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Posted: Wednesday, April 18, 2018 - 07:14 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Do you get a PE option for the flash hiders? They look a bit thick?



Hi Joe, the "flash hiders" are a bit thick, but they will be drilled after all the sanding and a good clean up. Just cleaning up this kit is a challenge. It's actually two separate kits, the deck and the gun separate.

Not sure what fires you are referring to , we are up in the snow line, north East WA state.

More to follow soon Joe. Cheers, Ski.
PolishBrigade12
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Posted: Wednesday, April 18, 2018 - 07:18 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Nice start, by the look of it got your work cut out for you.

Enjoy that deal, and remember no cursing, when kids or the old Lady is around.



Thx Jeff,

Once you get past the frustration all is calm.....for the most part, lol.

Thx for the encouragement. Cheers, Ski.
PolishBrigade12
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Posted: Wednesday, April 18, 2018 - 09:57 PM UTC
Building The Railing

Making the railing was pretty much a piece of cake, except trying to figure out how to keep all rails in line and correctly placed. I made a jig out of blue construction foam as a template in the desired dimensions for this scale. No, it ain't exact, but it'll do, close enough, lol.

I used standard 12/3 Romex copper wire for the top rail, 1/16" copper tubing for the mid rail and 3/32nds brass tubing for the main rail posts. Once the pieces were in place I soldered the mains. The mid rails were cut using the copper tubing and then attached using steel pins through the verticals to keep them in place.





Caution: Remember to use "lead free" solder only. I'm not sure if you can still get the old stuff, but I found some in my stash. The fumes are not good to deal with. We got way too many kits to build to be using that old stuff anyway, right?


More Soldering On Deck

The seat supports were next in line for soldering. I used some smaller diameter copper tubing for the supports and soldered them in the appropriate locations along the mid railing. Clamping the pieces in place was a bit of a challenge, but once I got a system going it went quick.







Next up, the flag, pole, and hardware. Thanks for watchin.

Cheers, Ski.
maartenboersma
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Noord-Holland, Netherlands
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Posted: Thursday, April 19, 2018 - 12:59 AM UTC


Your Painting skills will turn this into a masterpiece.
PolishBrigade12
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Posted: Thursday, April 19, 2018 - 05:53 AM UTC

Quoted Text



Your Painting skills will turn this into a masterpiece.



Thank you Maarten, very kind of you, Sir.
jrutman
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Pennsylvania, United States
Joined: April 10, 2011
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Posted: Thursday, April 19, 2018 - 06:18 PM UTC
This will be another stunner and on such a grand scale as well.
J
Dioramartin
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New South Wales, Australia
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Posted: Thursday, April 19, 2018 - 07:30 PM UTC
So the rest of the sub could be launched when that snow melts eh? Awesome Ski (again!)
PolishBrigade12
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Posted: Friday, April 20, 2018 - 06:52 AM UTC

Quoted Text

So the rest of the sub could be launched when that snow melts eh? Awesome Ski (again!)



Ya Bro, lol! But I think the snow shoved most of it into the muddy dirt. Either that or the dogs done buried it looking for moles, HA!



Thank you Jerry. I keep asking myself what you mentioned, why the big figs? I recon the younger I get and the better my eye sight becomes the bigger I'm gonna go, HA! sounded good, lol.

No doubt it will be a challenge to down scale when the time comes, been workin these big boys so long even this 1/16th face was jackin with me for some time. It wasn't that I couldn't see it, I was just not use to such small eyes. Weird, eh?

Thx for the kind words Bro, Ski.
PolishBrigade12
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Posted: Friday, April 20, 2018 - 07:48 AM UTC
Flag Pole And The Kriegsmarine Flag

Now, dealing with these tiny scratch built parts for the flag pole was a real "Baby Rump Kisser'! Pretty much every time I started to solder a piece anywhere close to something that had already been done the parts moved from the heat, Yikes! So, I had to work fast and I actually used the plumbers technique of brazing rather than having the solder already on my tip. I never claimed to be an expert at this, just tellin yall how it went, lol.

Note: Use caution when filing the slag away from your work, if you go too thin you'll be soldering again, thin joints won't hold under pressure or torque.

Once again, the rhythm was kickin and I got er done. The rope loop was a real hoot to get lined up just right and the disc up top for the swastika is made up of several copper discs soldered together for the appropriate thickness.

The flag was printed from an online photo and resized. The red color appears a bit faded, but that will actually work out just right. I made the rope to scale using three strands of heavy sewing thread by twisting them tightly, then I added a thin layer of good 'ol Elmer's glue all over it. I kept this new flag rope stretched out until it was completely dried. While waiting for this to dry I made small loops with the original heavy thread at the top and bottom of the flag portion that will be attached to the pole. Then, when the rope was completely dry, I ran it through the loops and mounted it on the pole. I will have to go back and paint this rope, maybe a medium tan tone, but it's pretty much complete for now.





Ok, here is the results so far. Everything seems to be in place and ready for the steps and wood work. Sorry, the flag mounted photo will appear later.




Next chapter below. Cheers, Ski.
____________________________________________________________


Adding The Tower Steps and Side Railing

This process was much easier than fighting the upper railing. I used the 1/16th copper tubing for the side rails and soldered in the supports, then added steel pins, drilled the holes and plugged them in. The steps, however, were a bit more involved.

I decided to go with Evergreen's styrene tubing simply because I had it in the appropriate scale and it was much easier to work with. Using the "Grab Handler" I heated the tubing at the joints and "slowly" bent them to the required angles. I then drilled the ends and inserted the steel pins and glued them in place on the sides of the gun deck.

Be careful when using any heat around this styrene tubing. Once all the deck work was done I washed the entire build down with mild soap to get rid of any residue from soldering and gluing, then used a hair dryer to quickly dry it off. Ooops, dopey me had it on high heat and you guessed it, I had to redo a complete side of steps! Ah, I needed the practice any way.

Also, before installing the support pins in each set of step I heated the ends quickly with the lighter, then smashed the tips against a block of steel to create the weld marks seen on the mounting locations for these steps. Simple and quick!






Next chaper coming up.............


Cheers, Ski.
edoardo
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Milano, Italy
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Posted: Friday, April 20, 2018 - 09:53 AM UTC
hey!
great build indeed! your craftmanship is second to none! i can’t wait to see some paint on it....
my only concern is for the flag: i always thought that kriegsmarine had a white flag.... maybe you can print both and see which will fit best
ciao
edo
PolishBrigade12
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Posted: Friday, April 20, 2018 - 10:26 AM UTC

Quoted Text

hey!
great build indeed! your craftmanship is second to none! i can’t wait to see some paint on it....
my only concern is for the flag: i always thought that kriegsmarine had a white flag.... maybe you can print both and see which will fit best
ciao
edo



Thx Edo, workin it hard. The flag, not sure what you're talking about, but all the reference pics I've seen are red flags. At any rate, it won't be changed, looks too good to pass up.

Thx again, Ski.
Pave-Hawk
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Western Australia, Australia
Joined: May 05, 2006
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Posted: Friday, April 20, 2018 - 12:13 PM UTC
Excellent work on the models, very impressive.


Quoted Text

Caution: Remember to use "lead free" solder only. I'm not sure if you can still get the old stuff, but I found some in my stash. The fumes are not good to deal with.



If it's fumes you are worried about then unless you are using fluxless solder, best go back to Tin/Lead solder, as the higher temperatures normally required for lead free solder will produce more fumes not less.
cheyenne
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New Jersey, United States
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Posted: Friday, April 20, 2018 - 02:29 PM UTC
Beauty work Ski , this is awesome , math , science , calculations , welding , hard work , brain stuff , now that's modeling .
Ok too much coffee , too early in the morning ........
I like this Ski and so far it's a stunner !!!!!

My Polish grandfather was a farmer and when it came to music , hobbies , crafts , anything other than hard work , he always used to say ....... " You're an idiot " .
PolishBrigade12
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Posted: Friday, April 20, 2018 - 07:35 PM UTC

Quoted Text

If it's fumes you are worried about then unless you are using fluxless solder, best go back to Tin/Lead solder, as the higher temperatures normally required for lead free solder will produce more fumes not less.



Thank you Iain, glad ya like er. No worries Mate, I'm using the lead free solder. I was thinking of using plastic rod instead, but that was like herding cats in a chicken house. Soldering has much, much more control, lol.


Cheers, Ski.
PolishBrigade12
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Posted: Friday, April 20, 2018 - 07:38 PM UTC

Quoted Text


My Polish grandfather was a farmer and when it came to music , hobbies , crafts , anything other than hard work , he always used to say ....... " You're an idiot " .



Ah, my Polish Brotha from anotha Motha, he musta forgot the relaxation part, lol. Me too Bro, bust your ars first, then you can play.

Speaking of, got a barn and pergola to put up this summer, so it won't be but a few weeks and the bunker will be pwered down for the season, bummer .

Thx for the kind words Bro, Ski.
edoardo
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Milano, Italy
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Posted: Saturday, April 21, 2018 - 11:01 AM UTC
you stand correct Ski. i was confused by the ww 1 flag....
keep up the great work!
ciao
edo
PolishBrigade12
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Posted: Saturday, April 21, 2018 - 07:51 PM UTC

Quoted Text

you stand correct Ski. i was confused by the ww 1 flag....
keep up the great work!
ciao
edo



No worries Amigo, it's always good to have a third eye Brotha, we can't think of everything all the time, lol.

That is probably why I always have a punch list made up as I go, something no doubt was forgotten.

Thx again Ma Brotha! Cheers, Ski.
Kevlar06
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Posted: Saturday, April 21, 2018 - 08:20 PM UTC
Ski,
A trick I use for bringing the color out of printed paper (like the flag) is to use the heaviest card stock I can find that can go through my printer, select “high quality” when printing, leave about a two inch margin on one side of the flag, clamp the margins in a clothespin, and using a sponge applicator and matte “Hoge Poge” decoupage solution, gentle dab the flag one side at a time. The decoupage brings out the color and makes the flag easy to bend realistically. I work it on a sheet of wax papers so it won’t stick to anything and hang it from a clothes hanger to dry. I do one side at a time— it’s easier to handle that way. When about 98% dry (not tacky anymore, yet still flexible) you can bend it into shape. Also keeps the paper from deteriorating over time. The sponge applicator gives it a nice uniform appearance like fabric.
VR, Russ
PolishBrigade12
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Posted: Sunday, April 22, 2018 - 06:34 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Ski,
A trick I use for bringing the color out of printed paper (like the flag) is to use the heaviest card stock I can find that can go through my printer, select “high quality” when printing, leave about a two inch margin on one side of the flag, clamp the margins in a clothespin, and using a sponge applicator and matte “Hoge Poge” decoupage solution, gentle dab the flag one side at a time. The decoupage brings out the color and makes the flag easy to bend realistically. I work it on a sheet of wax papers so it won’t stick to anything and hang it from a clothes hanger to dry. I do one side at a time— it’s easier to handle that way. When about 98% dry (not tacky anymore, yet still flexible) you can bend it into shape. Also keeps the paper from deteriorating over time. The sponge applicator gives it a nice uniform appearance like fabric.
VR, Russ



Now that is some worthy intel Russ, thx buddy. I got this copied and on the bench! Gonna try this out mue pronto.

thx for the hot tip, Ski.